Roostertail Talk
A show dedicated for preserving the history, breaking down the racing and looking to the future of the incredible sport of Unlimited Hydroplane racing. My name is David Newton, and I will be bringing you a weekly show in which we will discuss the boats, drivers, owners, crew members, legends, fans and anything that is involved with the sport that I love; hydroplane racing.
Fans you can now sign up for a subscription service for the podcast! As you can imagine, running a podcast can be pricey (from hosting fees, website fees, travel, equipment, etc.). You can help the podcast by subscribing to our new service, Roostertail Talk+. The podcast is still free to all on our website and through all major podcast platforms (such as Apple Podcast, Spotify, Castbox, etc) but with Roostertail Talk+ there is more you can enjoy ! With this service you will get early links to new episodes, enjoy access to extra content, raffle prizes and more. This is a new service that we will be adding to as we move along. As always your support to make this show grow is very appreciated! TOMORROW, there will be an announcement for the first prize for subscribing to Roostertail Talk+.
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Roostertail Talk
Episode 141: John Walters, Part 2
The evolution of hydroplane racing sits at the heart of this captivating conversation with John Walters as he picks up where our previous episode left off, diving deep into his pivotal years working alongside the sport's most influential innovators. From working with Muncey, Lucero, Heerensperger and other greats from the sport, John shares his insight and stories from a special time in racing. This is part 2 of the John Walters interview. Tune in next week for part 3!
Help the podcast by subscribing to our new service, Roostertail Talk+. The podcast is still free to all on our website and through all major podcast platforms (such as Apple Podcast, Spotify, Castbox, etc) but with Roostertail Talk+ there is more you can enjoy ! With this service you will get early links to new episodes, enjoy access to extra content, raffle prizes and more. This is a new service that we will be adding to as we move along. As always your support to make this show grow is very appreciated! https://www.buzzsprout.com/434851/supporters/new
Ruchetel Talk, the podcast dedicated to everything about the sport that we all love hydroplane racing. I am your host, david Newton, and it's time once again, so sit back, relax and welcome to Rooster Tail Talk talk. Hello race fans, it's episode 141, and this is part two of my interview with John Walters. Now, if you haven't listened to part one of my interview with John, please stop the tape. Go back to episode 140 and listen, because he goes into great detail about his background and into getting involved with hydropon racing, what got him interested and his path to becoming a driver. It says a lot listening to the episode because he just has such a great passion for the sport and is such an intelligent man that just gives great insight on so many things that the casual fan would not know.
Speaker 1:We're going to continue that talk today. He's going to talk more about his years with Bill Muncy at Muncy Racing, getting to know Jim Lucero, david Herrensberger, some other great and notable people around the sport, and just where his career took off to becoming a full-fledged, unlimited hydroplane racer. So let's jump in and get back to my talk with John. I know down the road you hooked up with Bill Muncy after that Fast forward, a few years before you got into work with the Turbine Pan Pack. You got some time working with Muncie and that team got to know Lucero I believe a little bit more on that team and I believe there was an exhibition run in Vancouver, washington, in 1979. And you got to drive the boat other than Muncie. Is that correct? Yeah?
Speaker 2:it is.
Speaker 1:How did that come about?
Speaker 2:Well, let me back up just a little bit. When we were still living in Las Vegas, I get a telephone call one night from a Mr Bob Esplin and Bob had just gotten a new Stoddaker boat that was just a bare hull. He called and asked me if I'd be interested in coming to Seattle and doing all the rigging and, you know, putting this boat together that they could go race it. As the Miss Burners, Arlene and I had talked about things, kind of discussed what was going on and decided that you know, when the kids were old enough, our daughters Katrina and MacIva, when Katrina was old enough to start school, that Seattle was really the area that we thought we wanted to settle down in. And so this was a dream come true to get this telephone call and, you know, be able to move to Seattle.
Speaker 2:They were going to pay for the move and everything else and have a job waiting for me when we got there and over that next year and that was 76, when that season was over, jerry Kalin the boat was in Seattle on Boeing Field there who owned the boat in Detroit, really wanted the boat in Detroit and he called Bob Esplin, had decided that he didn't want to go back to Detroit. And so he called and asked me if I'd be interested in taking over as the crew chief and moving to Detroit. I had made a promise to Arlene that you know, no, we're not going to drag the kids out of school and move to Detroit. And as flattered as I was to get that opportunity and that offer, decided that it probably just wasn't in the best interest of my family at the time. And so after that phone call, bob asked me what are you doing for lunch or what are you going to do?
Speaker 1:after lunch.
Speaker 2:And I said you know, honestly I don't know, and you know we had agreed that we'd get the stuff loaded up and whoever was going to drive it back there was going to take it back there. It wasn't going to be either of us. And he said well, if you'd like, if you don't mind, I'd like to introduce you to somebody and we'll go to lunch. And if you don't mind, I'd like to introduce you to somebody and we'll go to lunch. And I said, okay, so we did and went up Riverside Drive and Bob Esplin introduced me to Don Kelson and said you know, don's building a bunch of limited boats here and you know running really well with these things. I think there's a lot of opportunity here for you, john, to you know, use your skills, to you know, build boats with him, help design and build boats for him, and you're probably going to get to drive some of them too. And so that was a dream come true for me.
Speaker 2:And yes, I was very interested in doing that. Little did I know at the time that just up the street, a little ways across the street and up about four blocks, was what had been the, the pay and pack shop, um, and uh, and, and, and Bill Muncy, uh, I had purchased all the equipment, um, and was going to build a new boat, um, and so Jim Lucero dropped into the shop. You know, quite often he and Don um, you know, you know, went to lunch together occasionally, and then, and Jim had some influence on some of the boats that we were building, design-wise and that, and so over time I ended up working both places, and over time they both were more than a full-time job. And so Bill Muncy, at a Christmas party, invited me to be a full-time member of the team, and I really wanted to do that. But at the same time I had an obligation to Don Kelson and the Kelson family, who had helped me so much that I couldn't just walk out on them. And so the deal was that I would stay until we could get, you know, get a replacement um, and just being up and down the street like that a little ways. If they had a problem, needed a hand, um, I could help them, they could help us, you know, whatever. So it worked out to be a uh, a good situation for everybody involved.
Speaker 2:So, as it turned out, I didn't realize that the new boat was being built at down in, uh, auburn area, uh, normberg, uh, yeah and um.
Speaker 2:And so, uh, the the new, what was actually designed and built and was going to be, uh, the next pay and pack um was going to be the. The blue boat was actually going to be a pay and pack um. In fact, if, if, uh, you know, anybody remembers in the real early days, um, all the castings for the shaft log and the rudder bracket and skid fin brackets and all that sort of thing had pay impact, you know, cast right in them, um and uh, um, and so that boat was, was going to be the next pay impact after, after the wing wonder, um and uh, when Bill got involved and purchased the stuff, dave Herrensberger, after three national championships and two of three gold cups, a half a lap short of the third one there when they broke that propeller. And so I got to be involved in building that new boat, finishing the boat and working on the stuff, got to work with some great people.
Speaker 2:Lauren Sawyer, absolutely an incredible talent. So much fun working with Lauren and our paths crossed several times, which I talk about in the book a little bit.
Speaker 2:Lauren was just leaving Ron Jones Marine Engineering as I was getting there. So we worked there just a very short period of time together and then spent some time doing some things when he was with different teams Lincoln, thrift and different teams. Over the years Did work with Atlas and helped us build the boat. I had just gotten back from Norm's shop to the shop on Riverside Drive there and the decks were on it. Drive there, um and uh, the decks were on it. I was starting to install the hardware, uh, in different things. When, uh, when lauren got an offer to uh to go to another team and and um, and he went um, chuck king, I believe, was his name, and lauren was the crew chief on on the boat, and and uh and uh, and then, of course, and lauren went on to you to spend a lot of years with the Budweiser and different people there too. So so, yeah, it was kind of a a wonderful time, but really busy, working at both shops.
Speaker 2:I was working wherever they needed me the most and still racing boats, and every time we got a boat done at Kelson's I usually got to to go for a ride in the thing and, and, you know, help sort it out a little bit before we got a boat done at Kelson's, I usually got to go for a ride in the thing and help sort it out a little bit before we got it delivered and make sure that everything worked and did what it was supposed to do. And I got a lot of support from Don and Annette Kelson and the family, and I got a lot of support from Bill Muncy and Jim Lucero and that whole group, and so it was the best of literally of both worlds for me. We ended up. I actually got to test the blue boat a couple of times on Lake Washington before, and so I'd gone for a couple of rides in the boat. And it was one of those things where a lot of times, bill would come up from California, um, cause we wanted to break in engines or we'd gotten a new propeller.
Speaker 2:A lot of times it was just things that we needed to put some time on the stuff. And uh and uh, and Bill had come and watched me drive at Lake Sammamish a couple of times and come to some limited races and and uh, and it was pretty fun to um have, uh, to have Bill Muncy show up at some of the races and then hang out in the pits with me, you know. So it was a lot of fun there. But, yeah, then I got the opportunity to drive the boat in an exhibition race in Vancouver. Down there, that was. That was awesome, that was fun, and some of my favorite pictures on the wall here are of Bill Muncy, you know, putting me in his boat. Some of my favorite pictures on the wall.
Speaker 1:Here are of Bill Muncy, you know, putting me in his boat. So yeah, that was really cool. Was that surreal then to be like there, like him helping you get in the boat and you're driving his boat?
Speaker 2:Very much. Yeah, I can still remember sitting in the seat thinking just how wonderful this is, while Bill Muncy is undoing the front sling, you know, taking the sling off the boat, and my dad was there. I've got some great pictures of Bill and my dad you know, both my dads together and, yeah, it was a great time, a really great time, and just feel so blessed to have had so many opportunities with so many wonderful people.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, you just keep rattling off the names, Like there's so many people that you've been involved with over the years. Yes, Just it's amazing to think back on on on how connected you are like with, with with all these people. Yeah, yeah, Well, you were working with Lucero, working with a lot of, a lot of big names there, but somewhere sometime in 79 or so, I believe, Lucero was talking with Herrensberger about a new project involving turbines in a new boat. He wanted to come back in the sport and you got called up for that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, jim was doing some things consulting with Dave Herrensberger. Dave had started coming to some of the races and I remember Dave saying you know, if I had just stayed in the sport, all these races that you guys won with the Blue Boat, you know, could have been pay-in-pack victories.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I knew that he missed it, but I wasn't sure how serious he was about, you know, getting back involved. I remember going to dinner with the guys one night and and david said, um, he really wanted to get involved in the sport again, but he wanted to do it different. He didn't want to do the same thing that everybody else was doing. Um, and that was fun. Uh, that was one of the reasons it was so much fun working with with dave herrensberger and that whole pay impact group was that. You know, if you look back um, david did it all and he'd run conventional boats, he'd run Cabovers.
Speaker 1:He ran an Allison a.
Speaker 2:Rolls-Morland. He ran Chryslers for a while. You know so many innovations. The first honeycomb boat, you know there may have been boats that ran rear wings or different wings here and there at different times, but I think that Winged Wonder boat is the one that gets all the credit for the stuff.
Speaker 2:But I think that Winged Wonder Boat is the one that gets all the credit for the stuff and just so many innovative things that you know we did boats with, you know, were built out of foam and honeycomb and carbon fiber and titanium and so much stuff that no one had ever done before and it didn't all work. But you know, I know, unfortunately in life as well as boat racing, you always learn the most from the things that didn't work. And we were able to apply those things and some of the stuff that were very innovative at the time and we really weren't able to make work to their potential. A lot of it is now work to their potential. A lot of it is now. You know, when we put those front wings on on the pay impact that I drove, we didn't know where, we didn't know how, we didn't know. We just knew what we, we knew what the result was that we wanted, but didn't know how, exactly how to attain it, and those things caused, caused me, more grief and more problems in testing than they did. Good, we just didn't have the time to really make it work and to experiment and do this stuff with it, so we took them off and raced the boat. Without them, had we known what the next step was going to be the next evolutionary step, if you will. They were just too close to the leading edge. If we would have moved them farther forward, like we did in the second boat that I never got the opportunity to drive that boat, we would have won races with that boat and didn't get the opportunity. And that's one of the few regrets that I have is that I never got the opportunity to drive that boat.
Speaker 2:When it got sold everything to, steve Woomer and Steve Reynolds got the opportunity to drive the boat. That thing was a rocket ship, right out of the box and ran really well and was very much under control and very repeatable. And that was the big problem with the boat that I drove. It was just so inconsistent and never did the same thing twice. So inconsistent and never did the same thing twice. You know you could run the thing in. You know wind and water conditions that were exactly the same and get a different result every lap, and I never felt like I was in control of it. I always felt like I was chasing it. So that boat that Steve got the opportunity to drive.
Speaker 1:He had success with that. I mean a new team and all that, but they had success the the first year, yeah, with that boat after it sat for two years, right, yeah and um, and so there was there was some conflict there.
Speaker 2:I got my feelings hurt a little bit, I guess. Um, that, um, we had that boat sitting on the shop floor basically ready to go, and then we built one very similar to it in 82 for Chip, after you know, for the Atlas that Chip won his first gold cup in that thing, you know, came out of the box fast and ran really well and was very controllable and, in Chip's words, easy to drive. And I was a little bit frustrated that we had one home just like it that was collecting dust right now. And I remember the conversation and don't get me wrong, I love Jim Lucero dearly, but Jim had an ego and Jim's ego is what kept us from running that boat.
Speaker 2:Um, I, I remember the conversation when Jim said if we don't sort out, if we just jump ship no pun intended, um, if we just jump ship and don't sort this boat out, everybody will think that we couldn't make it work. Um, and Jim let his ego get in the way there. And, heronsberger, I remember him walking out, you know, in frustration saying I don't care, I just want everybody to think that we kicked their butt. You know, in one boat races, I don't care which boat it is, as long as it's safe and as long as it's fast. And so I think Jim's ego was that we had to prove that we could make that first boat work and win races, and then you could could move on to to the other one, and unfortunately, um, we didn't get the opportunities to do that.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that's just so sad that that boat never got to run with the paintback colors on it, because I know that it went to the torchlight parade. It did. People got to see it and, yeah, people wanted to see it on the water.
Speaker 2:Oh boy.
Speaker 1:And I just so unfortunately you didn't get to have the opportunity because I feel like there's this huge file of the what if happened, you know, in in hydropon racing and that goes in there Like what, yeah, so it's just, it's too bad. I totally agree with you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so yeah, that was a frustration for me. When we got ready to go to Miami in 1982 and we're taking the old boat, I thought why. You know, we've already proven, you know how well that boat works for Chip.
Speaker 2:You know, that concept works and I thought it would have been just as good with, with the turbine in it and um, and as it turned out, you know, by that point in time we were starting to make some progress with with the other boat, um, but again, it was still not. It was full of surprises. Um, you know, I was used to working with boats and working on boats, so when you make a change you'd have some idea of what the result was going to be, um, and in some cases it was, you know, uh, as predicted, uh and and and somewhat predictable, but in many cases it was not, and the boat was so light, um and just unforgiving. You know, like I say, I felt like I was, um, really restricted, uh with with the boat a lot of times, cause you just never knew what it was was going to do.
Speaker 2:Um, and we, you know, over time, evolution, if you will. I don't know that any of the boats that we did were revolutionary. You know it started with the 73 wing wonder boat, um. That boat, um, you know, came out and it was a thousand pounds lighter than than most of the boats you know on the circuit, I mean boats in those days, out of wooden aluminum. It wasn't completely out of character for a boat to weigh 8,000 pounds 9,000 pounds.
Speaker 2:That winged wonder boat when it went in the water for the first time it was like 6,800 pounds and with the things that were learned there, both aerodynamically and hydrodynamically, materials, technology, construction technique, that sort of thing the next step was the blue boat and, uh, and even whether that boat would have been a pain pack or whether it came out as it did, as as the blue blaster, that boat, um, was a thousand pounds lighter than the the wing wonder book.
Speaker 1:When that that?
Speaker 2:boat went, went in the water for the first time. It was like 5,200 pounds. Wow, wow, yeah, yeah. Never got a lot heavier than that. We. We broke it a couple of times and had to make some repairs.
Speaker 2:Um but I don't think the boat ever was over you know, 5,500, um, something like that. And then the pay and pack same situation, you know, because of the lighter driverain and engine. You know, power package with the turbine. David allowed us to use a lot of carbon fiber and a lot of titanium end ribs in the wing and the strut and the rudder and everything was all titanium. That boat was 4,269 pounds when it went in the water for the first time.
Speaker 1:No wonder why it was light then. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And a lot of bottom area in it. There was like 150 square feet of bottom in that thing. It had a very low angle of attack and so Jim was thinking that with the low angle of attack we needed more square footage. As it turned out, just the opposite was what we needed. And as we figured that out, that's what the second boat was and the blue boat that Chip was driving and the second pay impact boat and most of the boats that are out there right now. They've got a very high angle of attack on the bottom, up around five degrees and some a little more, in about 80 square feet of bottom area, high angle of attack in low amount of surface area. And with the Pay-In-Pack it was just the opposite. That thing towards the back was only two degrees on the angle of attack on the bottom and it had kind of an S-shape in it.
Speaker 2:And with all that square footage of bottom. When it pitched itself up it overreacted. Then it was so light physically and so much bottom area that it just wanted to fly away and it did a time or two.
Speaker 1:So yeah, and unfortunately that before you could race it it went over in tri-cities and yeah, yeah, so geez.
Speaker 2:I joke about that a little bit and it's another one of those quotes that's in the book. But Dave Herrensberger promised me that driving for Pay Impact would be the high point of my career, and it absolutely was.
Speaker 1:Figuratively and literally, literally. Yeah Well, driving a boat, because at that time turbines there was only one that I think successfully tried it in the U-95. And it was a different turbine, it wasn't the T-55s. But running those T-55s back in 1980 onward was that a bigger learning curve with that different power plant.
Speaker 2:It was plant it was. It was a lot of things that were different. Not just the mechanics and the engineering of working on those engines was completely different. The shop had to be set up completely different to be able to do that but the environment that we had to supply for them to be able to run in and run well, how sensitive they were to saltwater and that sort of thing, a lot of stuff that the U-95 guys knew about and kind of warned us about. In some ways they broke the ice on that stuff and helped make things for us a little bit easier, a little bit better. And fortunately you know some of the people Chuck Leifert, charlie Leifert and some of the people that I got the opportunity to drive it um was in Dave Herensberger's verbiage and his his words. There's a there's a whole story to how, how I got the opportunity to drive the boat, dave.
Speaker 2:Uh, we were racing at Green Lake still in those days and that weekend I was driving seven boats over the over the weekend and there were several cases where I'd come back to the pitch, get right out of one boat, get in the other and go out and drive the thing and ran seven boats that weekend and won five of the seven classes and fortunately Dave Herensberger was there to see that and that sparked some interest and so they talked about it a little bit and when Dave Herensberger made the offer he said, honestly, we talked about a lot of other people and he said I have to be honest with you, john, you weren't the first choice, but we know with you you don't have a whole lot of bad habits that you know we're not going to have to get somebody that's you know won a bunch of races. You don't have a whole lot of bad habits that you know we're not going to have to get somebody that's that's you know one of a bunch of races you know in a Merlin powered boat. And try to teach them to forget all of the stuff that they learned about driving that boat to drive this one. You're going to learn this for the first time. We'd have to retrain somebody to, you know, if we picked a more experienced driver.
Speaker 2:So that was, that was an advantage to me. It was also a huge amount of pressure. It was kind of a surprise, honestly. David Herrensberger showed up at the boat shop there one afternoon, the Monday or Tuesday after the Green Lake race and he and Jim had spent a fair amount of time in the office there and David Herrensberger came out and he said hey, can I get you to do me a favor? And it's like, of course you're.
Speaker 1:Dave Herrensberger, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're my boss, you're, you're, you're my guy. And he says do you know where the Seattle times building is? And I said yeah, where the Seattle Times building is. And I said yeah, and he said, about three o'clock, I need you to take something in there and drop it off for me.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I said, yeah, sure, I can do that. So, anyway, I had no idea, honestly, what was going on. So they had made arrangements, they'd made the telephone call and I was going down there to be interviewed as the new driver of the new, you know, revolutionary pay-in package, and so it was like going to a surprise party and everybody knew but me. It seemed like. So, yeah, it was a wonderful thing, everybody knew.
Speaker 1:But me it seemed like so yeah, it was a wonderful thing.
Speaker 2:And so when he asked me, you know, would you be interested in driving this new boat? I literally had to take a second to catch my breath and said, oh my gosh. Yes, absolutely yes. You know, we had some wonderful times. We had some bad days, for sure, oh yeah, and some life-changing experiences. I tell this story occasionally. It's been a while since I've said it, but that pay impact crash I spent 14 months in the hospital and had 20, some major surgeries.
Speaker 2:Wasn't expected to ever walk again, you know, got an artificial elbow on one side and a hip on another side and, and you know, knees and things that are put together with wires and screws and plates in my head and face and my back fused in three places and with all the stuff that I went, went through, my family ended up with all the scars. Um, it was so hard on on them and I can only that's another. One of the reasons that I wrote this book was to bring attention to um, how Arlene did some of the things that she did raised our kids, took care of the family, still was there every single day for me in the hospital and, um, it was. It was life changing for sure, good and bad. It opened so many doors and we got the opportunity to go places and do things and meet people and see things that probably would have never happened had it not been for the boat racing. And so you know, yes, there were some bad days, yes, I lost some very dear friends, but in the end, uh, there were more checks in the good boxes than in the bad.
Speaker 2:Um and um, I'm just so blessed to have been able to to, to be part of it. Um, and, frankly, that's one of the reasons that I continue to stay involved now with with H1 as a chief safety and technical inspector is um. It's my opportunity to you know, maybe teach some young guys um, um how to keep this sport going, um and and make it work and um. Too many people, including myself, um paid big prices, some the ultimate price, and then me too for a short period of time, I mean if you watch the sequence of that crash.
Speaker 2:One year Marlene got a telephone call from I don't remember if it was Channel 5 or Channel 7, king or Cairo said that they were going through their files and they were going to get rid of a lot of things after so many years and wanted to know if she wanted some of this stuff or if she thought that I would want some of this stuff. And a lot of it was boat racing footage from Seafair and, of course, mike's last crash and everything is on there, and it was a lot of confusion, um, with all the debris in the water and I looked like a hydroplane yard sale in the first turn there. And and uh, um, when George Johnson's boat was sinking, he swam over and crawled up on the pain pack and people's brains just instantly thought that that was that. That was me, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so they were looking for George Johnson in a completely different area than where John Walters was. I made a really foolish mistake in those days when I was driving on a lot of different boats. Um, I had different life jackets for different boats and different styles and different things. Um, I'd gotten a new life jacket. I was so confident that we were going to win in seafair. I wanted all the cool guy stuff.
Speaker 2:You know when I did the interview and uh and ordered it had ordered a new jack life jacket from lifeline and actually it was a rebuilt uh life lifeline jacket and had the parachute pack and everything on the back of it and I would always put on. Anytime I got a new life jacket or had it worked on, I'd always put the jacket on, jump in a swimming pool, jump in the lake somewhere and make sure that it would turn me over and do what it was supposed to do. This jacket was supposed to be there the week between Tri-Cities and Seattle. It didn't show up. Then it was supposed to, you know, be there before. It ended up coming Saturday special delivery UPS. They delivered it to the pits and I didn't get it wet and in that crash, because of the head injuries and the different things, I was unconscious. It didn't roll me over and I floated face down for almost nine minutes before they got to me Um, and I literally uh, was clinically dead, had no pulse, was not breathing, uh, no respiration, no pulse, um, and had drowned, um, because that jacket didn't turn me over. Now part of the problem was was my own, my own mistake, um, for, not for not testing it, but looking back on it now, what I think happened was that particular jacket had a parachute pack on the back of it.
Speaker 2:Okay, and when I drove conventional boats I would hook up the parachute. Conventional boats I would hook up the parachute If you were to get pitched out of a conventional boat, which usually would happen if you'd spin out or get in some sort of an accident sitting in the back. Back there it would throw you out, and that parachute had the opportunity to do what it was designed to do In the cabover boats. You're sitting so close to the CG and so close to the center of everything that you rarely get thrown out, and so I didn't hook up the boat. I didn't hook up the chute jacket. Another reason was, if you remember, chip was testing the Squire at one point in time and blew the thing over testing on Lake Washington the jacket he had a jacket just like that with a parachute pack on it. The parachute pack got tangled up in the wing bracketry and as the boat was sinking it was pulling Chip down with it, and so I didn't hook it up and I think what happened was in that parachute pack. There's a lot of air in there and that air tried to make it float and it did float, with me face down and with me being unconscious, I, you know, couldn't write myself or turn myself over, and so I literally drowned my mistake you know if I would have jumped in the water probably, you know, with that thing on and that parachute pack, you know filled
Speaker 2:up with air like that, I would have noticed that, and so that was some of the things that I learned decided that over the time that I was getting better and I still couldn't go back to work it took almost three years before I could, you know, really hold down a job again that there ought to be a, a committee, if you will, that investigates accidents and see what happened and see, you know, what injuries the driver you know received and and why and what could we do to fix that and what could we do to help that and what could we do to help that?
Speaker 2:And so um um, the competition committee and a lot of others. You know, things that are that are in place right now is a result of me being a crash test dummy, um and um and trying to prevent those kinds of things from happening to other people. So, um, a lot of times, like my career and other things, you know there's bad days, but if you can learn from those bad days and keep those bad days to a minimum and Jim Lucero and I figured out a long, long time ago that we're never going to be able to make these boats to where they don't crash the best thing you can do is make the crashes survivable, give the driver the best opportunity to survive a crash. And and I and I think you know there's still, there's always room for improvement. But other than george stratton, we haven't lost a driver and and really had any drivers very seriously injured. Right, you know, with the advent of the seatbelts and the enclosed cockpit and the breathing system and all, the things that we're doing these days.
Speaker 2:Generally you know if a boat gets upside down or there's a collision or a bad crash, usually you know. The worst is, you know, know the driver's got a damaged ego and wet pants and uh, and those are easy to fix yeah, yeah it's.
Speaker 1:It's been fascinating to watch the evolution of the safety of the sport because there's so many little things that have have combined to to make it to where it is today and and thankfully you're still here to help with that and it wasn't the ultimate sacrifice. I'm so thankful for that. And we've only lost one driver in the unlimited ranks at least since 1981, 82 with channel, with and I want to talk more, more about the safety things that you've contributed in your career after after racing. But was, I'm just curious with, when people's careers end, and I know yours was different than than most. You had 14 months in the hospital and countless surgeries and all that was. Was it easy for you at that point to say I'm done and walk away as a driver at least?
Speaker 2:No, actually it was not. It was very frustrating and and I'll be honest with you, I was angry about it. Um, I I'd worked my whole life to get to where we were finally at a point in my career where I thought we could win some boat races, um, and even in seattle. Uh, that weekend we'd made enough changes in the boat.
Speaker 2:Um, I was fast qualifier on the first day that thing ran 140 miles an hour, right off the trailer, right out of the box, and it was so easy to drive. It was so easy. I felt like I was just out there cruising around and I came back and when the guys told me how fast it was, I was surprised but I was angry that I felt like, geez, all that I've been through and all that I've done, and I'm and I'm not going to get to do the things that I wanted to do as a driver, I'm not going to win a bunch of races and I'm not going to, um, you know, win a bunch of gold cups and national championships and and that sort of thing. And I I felt like I still had a lot to give, a lot to offer and, especially with those experiences, thought that you know, I I could, I could do some good for the sport with the things that that I've learned, um, and could prevent happening to other people, other drivers, other teams. I felt like I owed this sport something and so I got involved again, Um, and Dave Herensberger um, I love that man very easily.
Speaker 2:After that crash, uh, when he decided that, you know, he couldn't do that anymore, Uh, didn't want to take a chance on hurting another driver or killing one when he sold all the equipment. He could have very easily said geez, John man, I'm sorry you got hurt. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. But he didn't. He put his arm around me and he said as long as I've got anything to do with this business, you've got a job here. Wow, you've got a job here.
Speaker 2:And I started going through a store management training program to be a store manager or something in the Pay Pack company and I was okay at it because of my experience with my dad's businesses and things I knew all about plumbing and electrical and heating and air conditioning and all the things that Pay Pack sold. I was familiar with all that stuff and I'd used all those tools and different things and I was a good sales guy for the store and worked hard at it and I think could have been successful at that. But my heart wasn't in it and I felt bad going to work every day that I need to try harder. I need, I need to to be more involved here. I need to. I need to give more. I need to.
Speaker 2:I need to have as much fun going to work as you know, selling um toilets as I did, driving a race boat, Um and um. It wasn't easy and Arlene knew that and she understood that and she's a big part of the reason that I got better and she's a big part of the reason, with the love and the support and that of the family, that I was able to get better and prove so many doctors wrong they literally thought I'd never walk again and you know, to be able to do some of the things that I can. It's a true blessing and I'm grateful and thankful for that every day.
Speaker 1:Well, I know I said this in the interview already, but we're so fortunate that John's still with us today and that that crash did not take his life. So scary to think back on and just to reflect on those wrecks that happened back in the day and where drivers usually did leave us in the bad way. But we're going to continue the talk. Next week we're going to have part three of my interview with John Walters. Until then, check us out on social media. We're on Facebook, instagram.
Speaker 1:You can check us out on our website online, wwwroostertaltalkcom. On there You're going to see a lot of fun stuff, all the episodes. But don't forget there is a subscription that you can sign up for called Roostertail Talk Plus, and it's a subscription to give back to the viewers with some fun photos from previous years, articles from back in the day, but also you get early access to all new episodes. I really appreciate all the subscribers I have so far. It really helps to pay some of the bills that goes into having a podcast because, as I said before, I am am a teacher. This comes out of my own time and time, but anything is appreciated from you, the fan. That's all I got for this week, so until next time, I hope to see you at the races.